When motorcoach operators advertise their businesses, they usually do three things: place an ad in the Yellow Pages, emblazon the company name on sides of their coaches, and create brochures they send far and wide.

A few brave operators add radio or television advertising to the mix.

And those that use broadcast media oftentimes swap their coach services for on-air time. But media trading can be a tricky business.

Still, those operators who swap charters for radio or television advertisements say its all pretty good and they insist theyre getting their moneys worth.

"Its working out just fine for us," says Dean Brown, general manager of the Milwaukee operation of Lamers Bus Line, which has been doing it for more than 20 years.

He said media bartering has led to friendships with radio personalities who sometimes drop by Lamers facilities and broadcast live, giving him a bonus over his trading arrangements.

Another operator that says it benefits from media trading is Knoxville Tours in Tennessee. "Weve been pretty happy with it," says company president Stewart Lusk, who has a bartering deal with a television station that rewards its big advertises with a free coach trip to two major NASCAR auto races. "We do quite well with the race trips," says Lusk.

Randy Cupp of Blue Lakes Charter and Tours in Clio, Mich., says hes been bartering for years, too, and it has generally been financial rewarding. However, he worries that the big jump in fuel costs this year could spoil things. "Im thinking our trades are going to start slowing down some because of what we have to pay now for fuel," he says.

Other operators dont care much for media trading, saying that while they get regular calls from radio and television stations looking to barter, they usually turn them down because the payoff isnt big enough.

"Radio advertising does absolutely nothing for us," said Jeff Polzien of Red Carpet Charters in Oklahoma City. He said because his business is strictly charter, the number of people who make charter decisions is too small to warrant mass-media advertising. "You have to do things like mailings to reach the people who make those decisions," he insists.

Polzien has done some bartering with radio stations in the past, but hiked up his price substantially and then gave the stations a 50 percent discount. "That way I still got my money," he said.

Tom Gobel of Lakefront Lines in Cleveland says he has given up the practice because he has seen few results from radio advertising. "I stay away from it now because most of it involves radio and I dont believe in radio advertising for our industry," he says. "Now if the Cleveland Plain Dealer (the areas daily newspaper) offered me part of the travel section, I would certainly do it."

Those that engage in the practice all have a different approach to it.

Brown of Lamers says he usually goes for a 3-1 ratio in his favor when he barters with radio stations that are running promotions for their listeners. But, he takes it down to 2-1 when the station is sponsoring a trip just for its own employees.

The radio stations he barters with produce most of the ads for him and then provide him with a log listing the times the ads will be running. "You have to be very careful of them trying to run them at 3 a.m.," he says.

While hes open to bartering year round, he tries to do most of it during the slowest times of the year. "When youre jammed to the max, then I would not want to do it. But when you have equipment sitting around, like in November through March, then it makes all of the sense in the world to participate in it," says Brown.

Lusk said the radio station-sponsored race car bus trips from Knoxville to Bristol, Tenn., usually end up in his favor by about $1,000. He also barters with a Christian radio station for two trips a year to a Christian music performance but makes those runs on a 1-1 ratio.

Greg Beach of Beach Transportation Co. in Missoula, Mont., has a different approach to his bartering. The company has charter and school bus operations and provides a couple of trips a year to a radio station in exchange for the station broadcasting a series of school safety tips to its listeners, all at an even trade. "The company name is mentioned but the ads are about school bus safety," he said.

Cupp, who works with about eight radio stations and one television station in the Flint and Saginaw areas in eastern Michigan, says he doesnt have a specific ad ratio for his media trades, but gets them in his favor most times. "If we have a $700 bus trip, then we get about $1,000 in ads," he explains.

He said his company designs the ads and uses radio station personnel to provide the voice talent when the amount involves only a few hundred dollars. For more expensive trades, the radio stations produce the entire ads.

"Being in the public eye and having a good rapport with the media is a good thing," he stresses. "And being friendly with media people isnt going to hurt either."

Cupp takes his bartering a bit further than most. His company belongs to a business trade exchange in which hundreds of businesses earn and bank barter points by performing services for member companies. Then, when a business needs the services of another member, it can obtain them by using its banked barter points. "We have a Christmas party every year for our employees and it is catered by someone in the exchange and we use our points to pay for it," he said.

Because the companies involved in bartering have so many different ways of doing it, Beach thinks the industry should look into the practice and possibly develop some payment ratios and other standards. "I would encourage the industry to consider the media trading issue and see if it can develop some guidelines and standards for all of use," he says.